intertext: (little my)
intertext ([personal profile] intertext) wrote2007-04-29 05:04 am
Entry tags:

Further developments on the elder millstone front

So I phoned her when I said I would, to find out how things went with the public health visitor. If I had been in a video game, I would have been knocked backwards by the ice that came down the phone when she heard it was me. When I asked her how she was, she said "Not Well At All Today" I suspect that she'd either had time to think about what a rotten person I am, or had been nattering with her Other Friend, another senior, about Young People Today and how thoughtless and generally nasty they are.

Apparently she was Suffering some kind of Stomach Ailment. She's complained of nebulous and indeterminate IBS for decades - now, as one who actually suffers a form of this myself, I do sympathise, but on the other hand can hardly be held responsible if someone eats something she shouldn't, and in any case this Ailment has nothing to do with the pneumonia that had kept her in the hospital. Also, I tend to get less sympathetic when she says "this has been going on for the last few days" and I ask "was it happening when you were in the hospital?" and she says "no..." but she was IN the hospital "the last couple of days..." The implication, of course, was that I had Upset her, and all the Stress had caused this latest Upset. She also declared that she Hadn't Slept a Wink All Night (and it was All My Fault, I could tell).

Not much joy from the health visitor, apparently. She can get home help, but - gee, what a concept - she'll have to pay for it. If you genuinely can't afford it, you get it free, but if you can afford it, you pay. Fair enough. This woman probably thinks she shouldn't have to pay (she no doubt thinks I would be a good "home help") So we are at an impasse. Or she is. But she can wait till doomsday if she thinks I'm going to offer to come and clean for her.

And if those of you who know me are wondering about the distinct note of vitriole that is seeping into this (I don't usually eat little old ladies for breakfast), I should point out that this was a woman who visited my mother for tea every week for about twenty years without ever, in my mother's words, so much as bringing a packet of biscuits or making any truly thoughtful or unselfish gesture. When my mother was dying, she didn't go and visit her in the hospital or come to the house when she came home at the end, or send flowers or a card either to her when she was ill or to me after she died. She got shirty with me at one point because I dared to let some time go by without updating her by phone on my mother's condition. And, what I probably will never forgive her for, she couldn't make the effort to get out of bed an hour or so early in order to get to the church by 10:30 am for my mother's memorial service. But of course I had to phone her afterwards and let her know how it went and send her a copy of the obituary and of the service etc etc etc.

Perhaps my lack of enthusiasm for this project becomes clearer?

[identity profile] a-d-medievalist.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 12:57 pm (UTC)(link)
Hey, I was convinced yesterday. You really don't need to justify yourself! Oh -- totally off-topic, but a good friend of mine is moving up your way to take a faculty librarian position. I don't know where you are, exactly, but if you happen to have just hired an incredibly bright and funny woman with an Italian name, you are very lucky indeed!
gillo: (polyanthus)

[personal profile] gillo 2007-04-29 02:33 pm (UTC)(link)
Fully understandable. You do not owe her your time. On no account feel guilty, which is her aim.

[identity profile] superfoo.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 02:53 pm (UTC)(link)
I'm sorry, but what an old bag!

Let me prelude this by saying that in general old people rock. So I don't think all old people are selfish and terrible.

A lot of elderly people think they deserve respect purely for being on this planet longer than others, and deserve care even when it screws around with another person's life. It seems this is the case for this woman.

Seriously, I would be so enraged if someone never even sent my mother a card, visited her, or came to the fricken memorial, and then after all that, had the audacity to ask me to care for them when they were sick! I commend you for not being a Giant Bitch (tm), because I don't know if I would have been able to restrain myself on that one.

Maybe I am a terrible person but "don't shit where you sleep" the saying is.

I think you are entirely justified in telling her to eff off. Don't feel guilty, either. If she really had few friends perhaps she could have valued the ones she had, like your mother, and maybe attended a memorial service. I can't even believe that she didn't show up for that.

I'm sorry, that was a really opinionated comment. But what I am saying is, don't justify yourself. You earned your independance and it sounds like this woman is probably the least worthy person to compromise it. Plus, a bitter caregiver is a crappy one - it's in her best interest to get someone who is a more or less 'happy' caregiver, regardless of whether or not she has to pay.
ext_6283: Brush the wandering hedgehog by the fire (Default)

[identity profile] oursin.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 04:26 pm (UTC)(link)
Am I surprised that this is a lonely and alone old person?
No.

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 05:29 pm (UTC)(link)
Precisely. She had a network of friends and acquaintances years ago and they all gave up on her for exactly this reason.

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 05:42 pm (UTC)(link)
Wow. Thank you :) Yes - that was an opinionated comment, but one that I badly needed to hear. You are so right. To be perfectly honest, she's never asked me outright to care for her in any long term way, it's just me being pretty paranoid about a lot of small things growing into one big one. She was dropping pretty large hints about the vaccuuming when I was there last, for example.

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 05:45 pm (UTC)(link)
Thank you. I'll work very hard on the "don't feel guilty when you say no" thing. I really should be either Catholic or Jewish - I have finely tuned and elaborate guilt mechanisms that my mother used to play like a master, and they all kick in in situations like this. That's why all this really strong support from you lot is so helpful.

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 05:49 pm (UTC)(link)
thanks :)

Most likely your friend is going to the "big school up the road" from us, unless she's at a college with initials CC. If so, I'll keep my eyes open for her. All bright and funny women are most welcome :)

[identity profile] chickenfeet2003.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 05:51 pm (UTC)(link)
I cannot see that you are under an obligation to this person in any way, shape or form.
gillo: (Crazy!Spike)

[personal profile] gillo 2007-04-29 07:38 pm (UTC)(link)
I watched my mother-in-law play those games for many years before dementia robbed her of the ability. And I recall my grandmother's hold over her sons. I devoutly hope I will not do teh same to my own children.

Perhaps you should write her a letter explaining that you are happy to stay in touch, but that you are too busy to be able to make any regular commitment of time? Writing creates a useful distance.

Yes, we all have those guilt mechanisms - I know any phone call to my mother is likely to leave me in the wrong - so sometimes I avoid making one, and then I'm in trouble for that too. In this instance you are absolutely in the right. If she'd been a frequent visitor to your mother and offered help in her care you might have had a debt to repay. As it is, you really, truly owe her nothing beyond common civility.

Here's a pretty Spike icon to cheer you up.

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 07:58 pm (UTC)(link)
ooh. I love the icon! Can I use it??

and thank you again for the sage advice :)

[identity profile] brinian.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 09:25 pm (UTC)(link)
A very wise friend of mine has a wonderful philosophy on friendship: it's like a bank account. Both of you make deposits and you make withdrawls. When the person with whom you consider yourself 'friends' constantly withdraws more than they deposit, it's time to reconsider whether or not you want to keep the account open.

You have my understanding, support and heartfelt admiration for dealing with this woman in a mature manner - not sure I'd be able to be so adult about it!

I think my mom and gillo's must be related :-) My partner does much better with her, so she ends up doing most of the daughterly phonecalls. *rolls eyes* But I'm just not evolved enough to deal with her in a similar vein, I guess!
gillo: (Crazy!Spike)

[personal profile] gillo 2007-04-29 09:33 pm (UTC)(link)
Of course - I made it, so it's totally snaggable.
gillo: (Fine man)

[personal profile] gillo 2007-04-29 09:37 pm (UTC)(link)
If she were penniless, that might be an option, though bloody rude, IMO. As it is, she can damned well pay for home help like anyone else. Why in hell should you clean up after her? Grr.
gillo: (Alas)

[personal profile] gillo 2007-04-29 09:39 pm (UTC)(link)
My mum's Welsh. They do guilt particularly effectively. *g*

[identity profile] a-d-medievalist.livejournal.com 2007-04-29 10:54 pm (UTC)(link)
Actually, I'm pretty sure it's the latter, as she's coming from a CC in the Emerald City.

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 12:03 am (UTC)(link)
Is there any brand of mum that _doesn't_ do guilt effectively?? If so, I'd like to meet one :)

[identity profile] lalouve.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 01:37 am (UTC)(link)
Do not get bogged down into helping this woman; in fact, run hard in the other direction. She'll be whiny and demanding, make you feel guilty, and not ever express gratitude. And she is able to pay for help, and would get it even if she couldn't, which means you don't need to feel guilty about it not being you helping her.

Of course she'd prefer to have your help for free. I'd like a big house in Ireland for free. That doesn't seem to be happening, either.

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 03:33 am (UTC)(link)
You are so right. Thank you :)

[identity profile] superfoo.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 04:42 am (UTC)(link)
I'm glad my comment wasn't ill recieved! I'm always reluctant when giving advice/opinions because I'm not Experienced In Life, but sometimes in situations where I clearly see people potentially becoming trapped or victimized, I have to be like OMG NOOOOO!

[identity profile] superfoo.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 04:43 am (UTC)(link)
That's an effin' hot icon.
<3 Spike.
gillo: (Nekkid)

[personal profile] gillo 2007-04-30 06:43 am (UTC)(link)
I'm a sad, sad fangurl - more than half my icons are of Spike. Feel free to take a look at them and snag any you want - if they aren't credited to someone else I made them and am happy to share.
gillo: (bloody revelation)

[personal profile] gillo 2007-04-30 06:45 am (UTC)(link)
I fear it's genetically programmed, though I try hard not to do it to my girls. I'm probably doomed though.

[identity profile] inaniac.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 12:22 pm (UTC)(link)
Ahh guilt, I know thee well. I actually stopped talking to my own mother after she threatened me with a lawyer.

Nuff said!

[identity profile] lalouve.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 02:07 pm (UTC)(link)
No problem - always willing to hand out unsolicited advice ;)
Seriously, thouhg, I feel you certainly deserve a fun life of your own.

[identity profile] a-d-medievalist.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 03:58 pm (UTC)(link)
no, you really don't. AFAICT, moms who can't do guilt are the ones who are so manipulative and crazy that their children are able to dissociate and call bullshit because they are entirely secure in the knowledge that they have done nothing wrong.

[identity profile] lidocafe.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 04:07 pm (UTC)(link)
Not sure if I can add antyhing of value--everyone has said what matters better than I could. I have to say that I was SHOCKED when you described this woman's lack of care/effort when your mom was ill and dying. That actually brought tears to my eyes. Can you imagine doing that and still claiming the status of friend? I agree with whoever said it's no suprise she's alone at the latter end of her life. And I agree with telling her / writing a letter explaining not only what you will or will not do but also where you're at in your life. The worst that will happen is that she will be mad at you and have to get home help. Whatfuckingever.

[identity profile] lidocafe.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 04:08 pm (UTC)(link)
Woops. I was trying not to swear in front of your guests, but you know me.

:)

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-04-30 04:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Ouch. Well, one of my best friends "divorced" her parents because her mother had been systematically abusive and her father had let it happen... Eek. Philip Larkin was right!! ("They fuck you up, your mum and dad...)

PS - love the icon.

[identity profile] countrygardener.livejournal.com 2007-05-01 05:15 am (UTC)(link)
A number of years ago a friend of mine had an elderly neighbor like that. She'd come over every day and complain of some ailment or other that necessitated someone helping her with this or that. One afternoon her children came to visit (they came very rarely), and my friend happened to mention that he though the old girl was a hypochonriac. A few months later the neighbor died. When the children came by to take care of the estate my friend asked what had happened. The son, without a moment's hesitation replied. "She died of what you said she didn't have." Cold very cold, but we've both laughed about it ever since.

Debbie, we've both done enough eleder-care pennace to last a lifetime don't you think?

[identity profile] intertext.livejournal.com 2007-05-01 04:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Yes. I know this last year or so with your mum has been stressful for you. You at least live quite a long distance away and can retreat to your own life and friends at the end of the day. I had a year or more where going to work every day was a struggle, where towards the end (the last six months or so) I couldn't go out at all in the evening, where going out for more than an hour or so even in the day became impossible. I had ten years where meals had to be served precisely on time at times that were not convenient to me, living in a house where I had no say in how it was decorated or arranged, full of inconvenient things that I didn't like, with the television or radio on full blast all the time to stations or shows that I didn't choose, during which time I had one, count them, ONE holiday away, and one three day trip to a conference, and those had to be pre-planned with the detail of a military campaign. I could go on. So, yes, I think that I, at least, have had enough for more than one lifetime.

Tourism

(Anonymous) 2007-05-19 04:43 am (UTC)(link)
Have you come across the tour of Paris choclatiers (sp?) Saw a TV news story about it - and can't stop thinking of a basil and lime chocolate that was mentioned.
MKB